Here comes your second homework!
1. multi-wraps with handler in different positions: set a bar at your current cik&cap height and have a dog do multiple wraps around the wing. Change your position so that you're sometimes on take-off side, sometimes on landing side of the jump. Reward by reaching in with a toy to reward close to the wing. Multi-wraps should always be your first exercise when you put the bars on the next height and you should keep working on them on each height, it's great collection jumping exercise, I actually do some before every training, within our warm-up.
2. cik&cap sequencing: we'll mask this training for different handler positions and moves into a little sequence and include a tunnel for extra fun 🙂 Start with cap on one, try cik with handler on a landing side on 3, a shoulder pull from 4 to 5, cap with a front cross on 5, tunnel again and then push for another cik on 7. Reward in the direction of where I set number 8. Break it down in little parts first.
3. 2on2off vs. running: time to address contacts! Send a video of whatever you've got till now if you are already working on it. If you haven't done anything about it yet, those two videos show first step of 2on2off (at 3:13 of this video) - stopping in the position on a box/upside down drawer:
and running (at 1:30 of this video - I hope it's fine I used your video Gitte 🙂 ) - running over a long carpet:
If you haven't decided yet, you can work on both, using a box or up-side-down drawer for 2on2off and a carpet or a wide, thin plank for running contacts - and then see what you like better.
Hi Silvia,
We have been out of town for a week and got back last night so here is a new video of Synergy with the cik/cap exercise and I combined it with a tough weave entry at the end.
Looking forward to your comments.
Thanks,
Marla
Cool! That’s VERY tight -- other than some tries when you’re really way too late with saying it. Try to say it REALLY early because even when you’re still in time on this height, you’ll be too late on full height as her extension take off point will move even further.
OK. Thanks. I will work on giving my verbals earlier. BTW, the tunnel is pretty far away but you can’t see it on the camera. That’s why she’s taking so long to come back:-) It’s about 35-40 feet away. Should I start to raise the bar a little? We are at 12″ right now.
Thanks,
Marla
If you have 14″ option -- go for it. I wouldn’t raise it to 16″ yet, though.
Silvia, here’s Toby’s first session multiple wrap. I did reward some jump bar falls off moment, what do you think? is this height ok for him? I think that a bit higher might be better, but i havent tried it yet.
Great! It’s amazing how tight he is, considering his size! Looks ready for the next height! Nice to see some of your new puppy too 🙂 His stays are amazing!
Thanks Silvia. Do i need to worry about the jumping bar fall off issue? I still can reward?
For my new pup Smores, I worked on the mat training with her right after i got her LOL I was amazed that how fast she got to know the value of the Mat 🙂
I prefer to reward when they’re not dropping it… But it’s sometimes hard to see it before you mark it, so… No big deal, but do try to reward when he is keeping it up.
Hi
Here’s a 30sec vid of our RC training on the carpet tonight. I seemed to think they were all pretty good at the time 🙂 Am i right in thinking #3, 4, 5 & 6 are the best? Would i still mark any of 1,2,7 or 8?
Some of them i started from a restrained position (which meant i couldn’t see as well) and others she started from a drop position. Is that ok or not a good idea bc she doesn’t have quite as much speed? It was easier for me w these ones bc i could stand closer to the end of the carpet
Thanks for your help
How long do you work w the carpet for?
5 and 6 are best. 3 and especially 4 are too close to what happens in the last try: instead of one very low front foot, no feet in. I like to have two feet in. So I would jackpot 5 and 6 and reward the rest, but I wouldn’t mark the last try: would just take a ball and try again. I usually start by sending a dog in a wrap or a tunnel so that they come with good speed. If not possible, drop is o.k. too, but you need to leave her far enough. I use a carpet for at least 6 sessions -- try to get a plank meantime. You also need to paint it, sand it and paint again to make it non-slippery.
Thanks-that’s really helpful!! 5 was from a drop and 6 from a restrain.Give me more of a clue what i’m looking for. A tunnel wld be good but bit of a pain to take it to the park all the time.
The people at the park thought i was completely mad videoing my dog running along a piece of carpet and cheering!! 🙂
Maybe you can take one stick in the ground pole… Or use a tree? You’re looking for smooth running with equally long and not too high strides and good hind feet separation (meaning hind feet are touching the ground at different spots, not together -- see my RC video I posted recently), jackpotting for two hind feet, two front feet or one front + one hind feet in the area that will once be the contact. Watch her run in slow motion as much as possible, it makes it easier then to predict where the feet will hit the ground and therefore easier to click it in time.
I meant to say, gives me more of a clue… 🙂
Thanks for the additional explanation though -- again, very helpful 🙂 I loved watching Bi’s RCs -- AMAZING! Is hind feet separation something that dogs do naturally when they run or something that only happens occassionally and you have to select for v actively with clicks and jackpots? Sorry, i don’t know too much about dog striding. I’ll try taking a pole to the park and lots of slow motion viewing 🙂
Very few people in australia train RCs -- I wonder if judges would have difficulty telling whether the contact was missed or not. Did you have any problems with that in Europe when people started using RCs?
(Julia -- you’d know much better than me. Does anyone use RCs?)
For my plank -- what dimensions do i need? What length do i paint as the contact area? Sorry that ive got SOOO many questions!! If i decide to do RCs i will definitely join the aug class. How long does it usually take to train a dog running DW?
THANKS
Hey Camilla,
Really enjoyed watching Grace on the carpet ! Looking good.
Not too sure about other states in Australia, but you are right -- not too many training RC’s in Victoria. (Althought there are a few who say they are ‘doing’ RC’s but not really training them if you get what I mean. )
There are a handful training RC’s on the A Frame -- my Cruz included with that, but not Ivy at this stage. I am flirting with the idea of training both stopped and running AF’s with Ivy -- but it really is only just an idea right now.
I think it will become more common in Australia to have a running A Frame in the future. There are a handful of people with up and coming dogs in WA training running dogwalks as well, so will be interesting to follow their progress. Even though I’m only auditing I’m also really enjoying watching what everyone is doing with their training here.
Camilla, if you pass on your email to me I am happy to tell you what I know about what people are doing here in more detail.
Why having both on A-frame? I agree it’s sometimes useful on DW, but I see absolutely no advantage ever in stopped A-frame AND it’s physically very demanding for the dog… So if you train for running A-frame, forget about the stop -- it’s easy to handle in any situation and easier to train as running DW, so we mostly don’t do stopped A-frames at all anymore.
Have noticed that most people in Europe seem to do running AF’s -- we are a bit behind in Australia and are very heavily influenced by US trends I think although there now seem to be a lot more RC’s apparent over there.
For me, I would have both simply because I have trained a stopped AF first so already have that behaviour in place. If I had trained the running first then yeah, probably wouldn’t bother to train the stopped as well.
@Camilla -- dogwalk plank dimensions are 30cm in width and each plank is 3.5m long -- no slats.
Thanks for the dimensions 🙂 I’ll get started making my plank..
Ideally, get two, as it’s easier to start with a wider plank than that and if you have two, you can put them side by side and have 60cm width -- much easier to start with.
Thanks Julia 🙂 In a spontaneous moment, I’ve signed up to the RC class!! You & Ivy should join us! You were exactly right -- I just checked out the intro page and there are lots of people from Western Australia. I’m going to try to train running AF and DW but see how we go..Grace might be 10 years old bf she makes it to a trial!
My email is cam_sleeth@hotmail.com and fb camilla sleeth 🙂
Hind feet separation is normal if the dog is running -- if the dog is leaping, then hind feet are together, that’s why you don’t want to see it on a carpet/plank 🙂 For plank dimensions, the best is to google for DW dimensions you use in Australia. We use FCI and it’s different from they use in US. If everything goes right, the training takes about 3 months -- but can also be longer. Real running contracts are actually very easy for the judges to see -- what is hard to see are “crawling” contacts, but running contacts are easy to see. I did get called with La a couple of times, but she has different, more difficult to see style (I trained it somewhat differently back then) and little merly legs. From all other dogs I know, none was never called for a made contact!
cool 🙂
Now, it is my turn of questions,….! Thank you Camilla for asking all the questions I had in my head already….!! :). I started the carpet training this morning…we did something before but not serious. Anyway, the problem is I have never seen Darwin running with the hind feet separated!!! He has great speed on the carpet and focus ahead but I cannot see his hind feet separated when running…!!! :(, may be, his legs are too short and the space between them is nearly inexistent!!! Video coming soon!!
Eva.
Yeah, some dogs do run with hind feet together all the time. If he runs like that also in normal life, then you can’t expect to see him run differently on carpet… Its’ not ideal for RC as they cover less ground, but it’s still possible.
This makes me remember when I caused a ruckus at the NADAC Championships in around 2004. I showed up with running Aframes on my BC and Pyr Shep. They stopped the trial and the judges had a meeting as to wether the way they were running the contacts was unsafe! After much debate they were allowed. I ended up 2nd with my Pyr Shep. We still had a stop on the dogwalk. After 6 runs we lost by around 6 seconds to a dog with a slow running dogwalk. After that I spent 12 months retraining running contacts on the dogwalk. We never hit the contact in all that time in trials. Finally one day it clicked and we never missed after that. With Nero it’s much more challenging for me as he’s bigger, stronger and faster than my previous dogs. Right now I just want to figure out the homework 3 sequence (myself).
Nancy
Ha, Nancy, you rebel!! Are you taking Nero to that mud run? It is this weekend, right?!
Go Nancy!! That’s a great story 🙂
All the dogs will tag along unless it’s supposed to be really hot. Nero is so social that he would have a ball meeting all the goofy people. Had a great herding session today. Nero had trouble switching cleanly from counter clockwise to clockwise to over the next week I’ll tidy it up by working on his tights which will help him turn better in that direction. Tight for me is Nero turning to his left…
Nancy
JIN HAS CHOSEN!!! :-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D
We will participate the next Running Contact Class!!
Because I have problems with my knees and sometimes I can’t run that fast I had many doubts but…..
Everytime when I see a video of Silvia (or a few days ago when I saw Zsuzsa Veres doing it at the Danicup) it really gives me goosebumps!! Really, all the time! 😀
And agility is all about FUN right? Well Jin (and I) had a lot of fun with racing on the carpet! So Jin has chosen 😉
I just want to make sure she also learns the 2o2o, so when I have a bad day and I am not fast enough she can also wait for me while I come strumbling 😉
Jonina & Jin
PS: Oh boy…. even more homework and comments to read! 😉
🙂 Yey, we got another addict 🙂 Running contacts are really addictive! And yes, I think it’s a good idea to go for both and have RC for A-frame and DW when the exit is easy and 2on2off for a back up when necessary 🙂
I say: go for it Camilla! 😀 Jin and I have just signed in for the next RC class and it would be great if you two will be our classmates again! 😀
Woo Hoo Jin & Jonina!!!
Oh wow, Jin was so fast on the carpet. How cld you not do RC -- it will be beautiful to watch!
HA -- looks like i’m becoming addicted too! I wld also like to have both contacts bc I’m sure my problem is going to be keeping up with grace 🙂
I found it easier to review G’s running when i placed the camera a bit closer to the carpet, focusing a little more on the ‘contact’ end + are you sure your editing program can’t do slow motion? My program doesn’t call it ‘slow motion’ but is has a function to alter the time of the clip. Hope that helps
You may just have inspired me…
Hi there, Camilla and Jonina, for sure you have to sign up for RC it is just the best! But oh yes, lots more to read and watch. i am battling to keep up with this class never mind the RC which we are way behind on but hopefully back to training with that again by next week, maybe i will have to sign up again in the next class, cause we are so far behind! It is so cool, but then again i am actually hocked on these long distance classes they are awesome. Happy Training.
Yay, join again! Hopefully we’ll see you and spy there 🙂
Yeap, Jonina, you definitely want to find a slow motion option! Mine is hidden under “speed” and then you can lower %. I don’t like too much of a close ups though as you want to see several strides, not just one, to be able to compare. At least, you want to see the whole carpet on a video! -- And then, just watch it frame by frame…
I did it!! Thanks for the peer group pressure guys 🙂 I never dreamed i would try to train RCs. Seems i’m addicted -- going to be fun…
Looking forward to being classmates again.
(looks like Grace’s homework is going to take precedence over my homework yet again this semester!! If only my teachers were as good as Silvia..my teachers are like old school trainers -- they’ve yanked on my chocker chain too many times and seems i’ve shut down!)
I will join RC too, but next class in winter…I can nearly cope with this one…! So many comments and videos and trying to get all the equipment ready too…!
And Yeah it is kind of addictive but not only for me for Darwin too!!! I cannot take him out of “our agility field..” 🙂 not even for a run in th beach!!!
That’s great, guys!! If I could get Princess Buttercup to chase a ball, I would do RC class too!! 🙂 I might take this class again in winter. or/and new tricks class.
AHHHH!!!! Hilarious….!!!!I am in stitches….!!! Jennifer, what about wrapping the ball in butter or peanut butter? Have you tried? I would like to have you too as mates again in winter for RC…;). Camilla and Jonina are way too fast for us…
Haahha, I think I have to catch a squirrel and put it on a string!! 🙂
i am going to tell you a secret!… I actually bought a real rabbit skin for Vesta and put it in a rope…It worked beautifully for the three first lessons…no joy after that…
I have sheep skin and a fox tail. he doesn’t really prefer it over a sock or a tug rope. he stops and wants to smell the fur 🙂
Hi Jennifer, You can actually buy squirrel scent. I did for some dachshunds that were in my class. You just put a drop on an enticing toy and they went crazy to work for it. I also used to sneak into my house and rub toys on my kids live rabbits to entice hounds and beagles. It’s tricky because like all rewards they have to be weaned off of it. Years ago we had a dog on a flyball team that wouldn’t carry balls unless we stuffed them with chicken. It turned out that he had bad teeth that had to be removed. Once the painful teeth were out we didn’t have to trick him anymore. He was an aussie mix.
Nancy
Thanks, Nancy. His teeth are fine, white and healthy gums. Squirrel scent might be worth a try. I’ll try anything! 🙂
I can believe it! I am not the only nut here…!!!! I have pheasant, rabit, and duck scent…the funny thing is that it worked only the few first times after a while she preferred the live ones!
Glad to hear you are going to be with me in RC! By the way tell us everything about the “mud run” 🙂
Eva, The website for the “mud run” has the greatest video. It’s http://www.thedirtydash.com. I just love that song that is the background. I’ve already made a tutu to wear so that I am in an appropriate costume. I don’t know how many 12-15 year girls my husband and I are driving 3 hours to do this race. I think that our team is up to 20 though!
You HAVE TO TAPE IT!!! Please put on YouTube!!! I wish I could go with you guys! Buddy is a mudder! 🙂
I WANT TO GO TOO!!!! I WOULD LOVE IT AND DARWIN WILL LOVE IT TOO!!! PLEASE, PLEASE TAPE IT AND UPLOAD IT IN YOUTUBE…!!!!
Hi Eva, I’ll likely join the winter RC class as well. I can only keep track of one class at a time so it’ll be the first that starts when this class is over.
Nancy
Ha! You guys are hilarious -- squirrels, rabbits, foxes! Great ideas. I’d better start rubbing my toys against some kangaroos 🙂 🙂
Eva- great to hear that Darwin is so obsessed w agility (It’s pretty obvious from his vids! That little cutie). That’s cool that you’re all going to do RCs -- I’m sure i’ll be in that class too
🙂
Same for me! 🙂
Yeah, RC are somewhat harder for dogs with different speeds… But we actually have some dogs in RC class that improved their speed a lot because of RC. For taking the same class again, you get 50% discount.
Haha Eva and Jennifer you really make me laugh!! 😀 Funny the ideas you get!
Big respect for not giving up and try to find new things for playing with and motivate your dogs! Jin is the opposite, which also can be difficult sometimes. She gets too busy in her head (when I get her ” favorite’ toy) and doesn’t think anymore. So instead of smelly skins I had to buy a boring toy LOL!
I understand that most of you guys will join the RC class 3 in the winter. 🙁
I also thought of it, because yes it is a lot, doing two classes the same time but then again we are on half of this class and if we will have such a winter in Holland as we had last time I will not able to do the RC 3 at all.
I saw there will be another “tricks” class (for ex- puppystudents) in October 😀 Oh boy this classes sure are addictive! 😀
Jonina & Jin
Oh and folks, I finally figured out how to put my video in slow motion! 😀
I think I need to be educated on the rug running. The carpet piece I’m using is 12′ long and 3′ wide. I have a second piece so could make a 24′ long stretch of carpet. In the video, Bree is going to a stationary toy that I’ve thrown right before releasing her.
In the earlier attempts, she appears to be running but I don’t see much hind leg separation. Or maybe I do? I’m not sure what I’m looking for. In our session yesterday, Bree apparently has decided one hit in the middle of the rug is all that is necessary. Doesn’t look like this will work well on the DW, though it looks exactly like what I’m getting on the down side of the AF right now.
The clicker doesn’t sound in the slow motion mode, but basically I’m going to need to work on my timing. When I watched the video, the click came consistently after Bree had left the rug. 🙂 I also clicked runs that shouldn’t have been simply because I couldn’t see well standing behind her.
One more question…….if I don’t like a run and don’t click, does Bree still get a tug game with the toy? She shuts down pretty quickly if she perceives she’s wrong (like by not getting her reward) so I want to be careful to keep her enthusiasm in place.
Thanks for your help. BTW, we’re signed up for the RC class too. 🙂
Good, RC class will clarify you more on hind feet separation and everything 🙂 She has hind feet separated, but is running very “airy”, so I wouldn’t be clicking her at all for now. Let’s try a longer carpet, starting her further back and throwing a toy further. Don’t use static toy, let her chase a ball, ideally a ball that rolls well so that is not pouncing on it. The important thing is that you play significantly more and more enthusiastically for good runs vs. not so good ones -- but you can play some for those too if you think she will shut down otherwise.
Here are our multi wraps (next time will check to be sure jump is centered in the camera’s viewfinder!) and the sequence. In the sequences I think she was tighter the times I got the info to her earlier. I reversed the sequence just to perk her brain up because we were filming on a hot, humid evening at the end of a busy day.
I’m not completely sure how tight one can expect wraps to be when speed is added in. If these are tight enough, I’ll move up in height.
Many thanks.
Very nice multi-wraps!!! Very good idea to reverse the sequence! I would work some more on tightness in a sequence too, though. Of course, make sure your commands are in time, but do redo the widest ones by doing some multi wraps there. Also, do some tunnel-wrap-tunnel-wrap games to teach her how to turn with speed too, she can definitely do tighter as that, so I wouldn’t raise the bars just yet.