For more on running contacts, it's best to join running contacts class or get a Running Contacts DVD. This page is meant for those who just have a quick question or want to show their finished product - you are very welcome to do so, it still brings a smile to my face when I see a beautiful running contact, it's something addictive about it. It is on times frustrating as well... - but it all makes the end result even sweeter. So... Happy training, everybody!
 Last call for May classes! You can still join us in Tricks/Puppy class – or Running Contacts Repeaters class!!! |
 Silvia Trkman is known for bringing every dog, from her first dog on, to the very top of the sport. Her dogs are known for great speed, tight turns, running contacts and long and injury-free careers. Silvia is in agility since 1992 and is– 3x World Champion (with two different dogs)
– 5x European Open winner, with 4 different dogs (Lo, La, Bu, Le)!!!
– National Championships podium and World Team member with every dog she’s ever had – National Champion for 22-times (with 5 different dogs of 3 different breeds) – World Team member for 19-times (mostly with at least two dogs at the time – sometimes four 🙂 ) |
Hi Silvia,
This is the finished product of our running dogwalk. I don’t know if you remember, but you were a tremendous help to us on our rc journey, and this is the result! =)
Thanks so much!!
Sooo cool! It sure looks great, congratulations!!!
Hi Silvia,
Just wanted to share with you Macha’s latest 4 stride pattern on the DW. I named it her ‘Flying Squirrel’ move. I have not seen her do this on other DW yet, there she usually puts a fifth stride in at the second apex, but hits the contact the same. She keeps amazing me every time we train RC and I can tell you it sure is very addicting!
Thanks for all you help,
Sietske
She sure can fly!!! 🙂 Great job, so cool to see her run like that!
Hi Silvia! This is Astro as I told You we are doing running a-Frame, because You told me he Was not having to much rear legs separation I decided to go back and do moré flat Work, this video is his first training on a flat ramp, he is doing rigth? If he is doing rigth How many moré setions we should do before raising The a-Frame?
Thanks!!
Looks great -- beautiful separation! I would do about 10 sessions on flat and then start raising it and slowly limiting approach speed to avoid flying over the apex.
Thanks Silvia!!! Should I raise The A -Frame at 1,5mt or less?
Oh no, you can’t do that with the dog who didn’t do DW work! You need to raise it gradually, limiting the speed on the approach to avoid flying.
Oh!! Thank You 🙂 I will show You The final result. Hugs!!
Here is Macha’s training session from yesterday. Now she is altering her striding a bit in a sense that she is losing some hind leg separation when she hits with hind legs deeper in the contact sometimes. It looks like she wants to be more efficient/faster to catch up with me and she pushes of the contact with both legs together. They do that when they accelerate and it seems she is trying to accelerate off the contact. She does not really leap and when you see it in real time (this is 50% slowed down) it is hard to catch. I have been rewarding those tries since it is so hard to see and she is hitting the contact okay. My worry is that when she comes from a 180 no speed approach (for example tunnel under DW) she tries to extend her first stride on the down ramp (lands FF first), but she cannot reach as far and hits higher with hind legs in the contact. Now if she shortens just a bit and if she loses her separation in those cases she will miss……. Not sure what to do about this and how to fix it. Maybe I am worrying too much, because she is hitting a 100% in training now, but I know in competition with an 180 approach and an angled exit she will be likely to miss the contact this way, since she usually is a little bit more hesitant. I watched Dug the Golden go through something similar when they started to train turns or more difficult exits. Does this go away with more confidence?
Thanks,
Sietske
I wouldn’t worry about less separation on deep hits, but would NR high hits with bad separation (but R high hits with good separation). NR hits that you know would turn into a miss in trials… Loosing some separation is common when introducing curved exits, but I make sure to mix in enough straight exits (and handle too big curves as a straight exit) to keep decent separation. For 180 degree approaches, I would use easy straight exits for now and only gradually add difficulties on the exit too. In trials, handle everything as a straight exit if she comes to a DW from a difficult approach.
Thanks Silvia,
I will work on that. She seems to be stuck in a certain stride pattern on those 180 approaches and she is not able to hit deeper. She tries to extend as much as she can, but only hits high if she has enough separation. I am not sure how to teach her to extend even more. She has to alter her stride before that, probably already when she comes up on the up ramp. I have a trial weekend in 2 weeks, so we can test her RC again. We don’t have many opportunities to trial here in the winter 🙁
Sietske
Good luck for the trial! I think she extends her stride over the apex enough, she would just need to reach well, with good separation, on the next hit -- so definitely a good exercise for her to learn the separation and reach are important 🙂
HELP! I actually think Macha is leaping on those hard entries!!!! I set up an exercise with 180 degree turns up on the DW coming from a jump or a tunnel underneath the DW going to a curved tunnel about 18 feet straight from the DW (easy exit) or to a slightly angled jump 15 feet from the DW. She hardly has hind leg separation and misses or has very high hits. Not good at all. The first video is from 3 days ago when I did full speed straight entries and she hits beautifully…….I am not sure what to do. Should I lower the DW again for these no speed entries? Or use a carpet at the down ramp or a plank at the down ramp? Not sure how to fix this :(……. I guess she doesn’t really understand the whole concept yet, even after a full year of training it 🙁
Thanks, Sietske
Great hits in the first video -- interesting that difficult approaches are harder for her as exits… Definitely make them easier, either by allowing speedier approach first and then moving the jump/tunnel farther&farther back gradually or lower the DW or add a carpet yes -- you can try it all and see what gives you best results.
Hi Silvia,
First of all congrats for your runs last week end, it’s stunning how fast Le is!!
I have a question concerning the plank.
With the first dog i trained with rc i used a plank with 2/3 length of one part of the dogwalk as i had to transport it. At the end his rc were’nt really well (as i did some faults).
Now with my ”puppie” (she’s 10 month now) i would give it another try, so i’ was looking for a new plank, and now my problem, i can’t find a plank which is longer than 2,50m, not to mention 3,60m….
Do you (and you students) use planks with this full length? Did you attach 2 parts together? I would prefer to use a plank (in one part or not) which has the same length as the dogwalk, so the difference will not be so big….
Thank you a lot!
Greetings from Luxemburg
Julie
The longer-strided the dog, the longer plank you need -- for some even 3,6m is not enough 🙂 You can get longer planks at farmers who have woods (that’s where I got mine) or you can attach two together, it doesn’t matter. I doubt the length was the only problem though, so I would recommend RC DVD.
Thank you!! Yes, i will buy it. I’m sure the length was’nt the only problem! But i want to avoid every possible problem i can.
She’s a small Working Kelpie bitch (45cm) so i think 3,6 will be enough?
Hiii Silvia,
I bought your Dvd but have still a few questions….
I train now for the 6th session on carpet (3,6m)
The first time (with her Ball 5 m behind the carpet) the hits were 85%, the next session was much worse as i started to throw the ball.
I tried to adjust the carpet (about 4m) and she has much more hits.
the next sessions she was sometimes in, sometimes not…
She startet do get slower as i only rewarded when she was in so i decided to reward her only for running. I think the problem was i’ve thrown the ball to high, she looked at the ball and leaped…
At the end of yesterdays session i abridged the carpet again to 3,6 m and i really tried to throw the ball very flat and she missed not one. (when she is in then with hind feet at the last third and nice hind feet separation).
I see 2 problems now, she only hits if the ball is in the right position and that she hits not because she try to set her hind feet in the contact, but because she hit by chance. I think she don’t understand that the click is for good hind feet positioning….
How should i continue?
Thank a lot and best regards!!
Julie
If dogs would start to try setting their hind feet in the contact on the 6th session, then the DVD wouldn’t be 3 hours long 🙂 Maybe you can expect it on 60th session, but certainly not on 6th… She definitely is hitting by chance and your job is to make a chance high enough that you have enough things to mark&JP, so that’s very good you found a way to help her hit. Do another 5 successful session on carpet, then switch to flat plank for another 5 successful sessions and then you can start raising it, doing all you can to help her hit and giving her time to figure out what you’re rewarding. As long as she understands clicker and NR vs. JP, she will figure it out with time.
Okay! so you go to the plank and raise it up before the dog understands that he should try to hit with hind feet?
She hits now almost every time, but most of them with front feet!
I send her around a pole so she comes with speed to the carpet, when her first step on the carpet is with front feet, she also hit the contact with front feet, and when the first step on the carpet is with hind feet, she hit the contact with hind feet! I tried to adjust the carpet again so i could JP the hind feet hits, but not with big success.
So what would you do? Different start position? only reward hits with hind feet and no reward for hits wit front feet? If i don’t reward front feet hits (so most of the tries) i think she will stop running full speed….
Should i stay on carpet till she hits with hind feet?
Thank you so much for your help!!
Yes, I start raising it way before I expect them to adjust the stride! -- See the DVD. I also mention there many dogs prefer to start a flat carpet/plan with ff and with particular stride length, that automatically gives you ff hits. You can of course R/JP that and the only way to get rf would be to make the carpet 0.5m longer OR to limit her speed on the approach. But no need to worry about it, you can switch to a plank and work on striding options when you have more length (real DW).
Hi Sylvia,
Me again. We are nor for some time already on the real dogwalk, i’ve watched your DVD a few time but still a little problem now.
To a high of 50cm her contacts were really good, the last session on that heigh every try a hit with one ff and both rf with good separation. If she missed some ones on the sessions before it was alway on the same side.
I understood something wrong at the beginning with ”fading the toy” i thought i have to fade it as late as possible (don’t know why i thought that!) and as i’m really bad in throwing toys it make the contacts worse when i threw to high…
Well, the last session on 50cm heigh i fade it and her contacts were great!
Today was the 3rd session on 65cm, and they are’nt good at all anymore and i don’t know why……
To explain a bit, i’m always on the same side of the dogwalk as i have not so much space, but i train it in both directions. i send her around something 6 meters before the dogwalk and fade a toy behind a jump 5 meter after the dogwalk.
I noticed today that on one side were 7 meters between the obstacle i send her around and the dogwalk, so i adjusted it and it was a little bit better. But IF she hits, they are’nt deep.
As she got slower because she was unsure after some misses (as i could JP nearly every try the last sessions) i lowered the criteria and played also for high and FF hits and also a bit for no hits.
I stopped to do the whole dogwalk, and tried with the ”contact game” to see if she hits when she starts from the right position. It was better and she had 2 good hits before we finished for today.
I’m not sure how to continue now…. was it too much to raise it 15cm in one time?
Should i change the starting position and train different ones? Or doing only the downgoing part to help her hit?
Thank you so much for your help!
It is so much fun to see her running, i really want to do too much mistakes….
Tahnks again!
Greetings from Luxembourg!!
Julie
Some heights can affect their striding a lot yes, so you probably need to find a new good starting spot. Try to see what changed in her striding and then play with starting spots some. To keep successful rate high enough, start her on a DW sometimes as well. You could also just go with that spot and then move her back one stride at the time.
Hi again,
For first, thank you for your help you gave me already.
I’m quite frustrated for the moment…. 🙁
We are training for a long time already on a full dogwalk, for the last 2 month on the same heigh (55cm). First i thought she was missing some contacts because i throw the ball to high, or to wide or something. So i put the ball behind a jump. The first session was PERFECT! In the next sessions it got worse and worse as she is’nt running full speed to a stationed toy. Well, new plan i did what i never wanted to do and put a tunnel behind the dogwalk. First session GREAT! So i put a jump between dogwalk and tunnel. Somtimes we did tunnel-dogwalk-tunnel, she ran full speed and had very good and deep hits. I clicked the hits and sometimes (as she knew that was a jackpot 😉 ) she came to me before going in the tunnel so we played as the contact was great.
After 2 sessions (again worse!) she did’nt run full speed in the tunnel anymore and missed the contact every time. I thought it was maybe a fault to let her come to me before the tunnel (3-4 times) and i stopped and played every time after the tunnel. So i thought i would continue (at least one jump) after the tunnel, so that she has still a reason to run full speed in the tunnel. First session again great, next 2 BAD 🙁 She misses now nearly every contact, sometime i can see that she slows down already before the contact and has no focus to the front anymore. if i can get her really exited she has beautiful hits, but now i don’t know anymore what i can do to get her running full speed.
From time to time i thought she were maybe to ”tired” to run full speed after 5-6 tries as it is quite hot here at the moment so i decided to stop after 4 times doing the dogwalk, but that is’nt the best solution i think if she misses the 4 tries…..
Maybe you have any advice how to continue….
Is it still possible to join one of your long distance running contacts classes? I tried to open the page but there is only an ”error message”.
Thank you a lot in advance Silvia, runnings are so much fun, but for the moment i’m no more motivated to continue 🙁
Maybe go back to throwing a toy again? Or try racing her more? Also, relax the criteria some and give small R for every try to keep her happy and fast, she sounds very sensitive?
And yes, you can join June RC class -- the page might work if you open it in another browser, but please let me know when you tried to access it and exactly which page (long-distance classes?) to be able to report the problem as several people reported this and we can’t locate the problem… So please, let me know!
Hi Sylvia, I’ve been retraining my working cocker’s contacts since before Christmas, following your DVD. I thought we were doing really well and that I was developing an eye for the right leg action. We had what I thought was a great training session yesterday, about 85% successful hits and I thought good leg action. Turns out when I watched the videos back in slow motion I wasn’t seeing it at all! Instead of good running I was actually getting sometimes back feet together leaping without height, lots of front feet right in the middle of the yellow but back feet off the board, and with these possibly some overreaching. I’d be grateful if you could look at the edited “highlights” which hopefully shows what’s happening and see where we’re going wrong, if I can improve the setup (full dogwalk on bricks?), whether the front feet hits are acceptable…..as I said, we had mostly feet well in the yellow, just four or five real leaps from above the contact all session, but the little feet go through so fast I’m obviously not seeing what’s happening. Apologies for the poor quality!
Sure, ff are fine as well -- that doesn’t look like a real OR yet (but do keep an eye on it). Separation should be better though, but the problem could be not speedy enough start or jumping on a plank as such. So yes, if you can put the DW that low, maybe the best is to try that -- she should have enough room there to get full separation by the end, so you will know if she is really leaping or not.
Thank you, I shall try that tomorrow and report back!
Kay
Hi Silvia, here’s today’s attempts using a full low DW. Better I think? I did try to see what the feet were doing but clearly not very good at it! We seemed to get quite a few front feet in the middle with a rear foot very low, there was good separation on these….are they OK? Only two leaps I think. I don’t think she’s in full extension yet, we can get more speed in (round a cone or from a tunnel) but should we yet? I’m getting quite worried if I can keep up with her!
I appreciate your comments and help, it’s a roller-coaster!
Kay
Hm, yes, she either hits with ff and then has beautiful hit with nice rf separation and reach OR she has high rf hit with bad separation -- despte she could hit nicely&deeply with more reach and separation… Looks like ff preference to me… Maybe mix in some flat plank/carpet work and JP big time if you get rf with good separation?
OK yes, we can go back to some of that, I have some coloured vetwrap on order to help me see her rear legs better so I can reward better….good thing I haven’t started using the clicker yet! I’ll also try a bit more speed on, send her from a tunnel or something, see if that makes a difference. Thank you!
Kay
I don’t think it’s the approach thing as she has great separation on ff hits. I can definitely see the ff preference pattern here.
Hi Silvia!
I have a quick question if you don’t mind?
My spitz (34cm) seems to lack short when trying to do the dog walk with two strides, when doing it like La on two and a half strides she makes better hits.
Should I stop rewarding her when she tries to do it on two even if she hits the top of the contact area with her hind feet? I would like to encourage her to do it on two and a half and hit the contact with her front feet.
Definitely don’t reward very high, unsafe hits -- and let her figure it out how to meet the criteria. I wouldn’t insist on one striding pattern though. At her size, she will probably need 2.5 strides yes, but it would be even better if she started and finished the down ramp with rf rather as ff. So maybe stay on low DW with not too pronounced apex until she figures it out?
Thanks, we will keep on working! 🙂
Hi Silvia, I want to ask you a question… I raised a little bit the A-frame for Astro, but I´m not shure if from this height I should have him close to the A-Frame. thanks
For now, it’s fine. Only limit his speed once he starts flying over the apex rather as running over it -- probably won’t happen before 0.6m or so. Looking good!
Silvia, Now I have The A -Frame 55cm, and Astro iş starting 1mt before, sometimes I restaron him and some times I am 2mt in front, he is doing great first session, we do a session of 15 repetitions, I give him a break of 10 minutos and again some repetitions, but second time he iş not running at full speed, my question is… It’s ok just to do one short session per day?
Thanks
Sure, no need for more repetitions as that! You can keep raising it, you don’t need tons of repetitions for AF.
Hi Silvia,
I was wondering if I could get some RC advice?
We had a seemingly perfect RC, until I removed the slats on our home DW. She hits very high, and barely hits the contact. She does fine on slatless DW in trials, but they’re rubberized. I tried a low board that is also slatless, and she still hit high. Could it be that we’ve been focused primarily on the teeter with a 2o2o? Maybe I’m overthinking it, and I should just wait a bit?
Anyways, thank you so much for all the help you’ve given us before, and continue to give us. 🙂
That is very strange… I doubt it’s teeter confusion, I think it’s maybe grip thing -- maybe she doesn’t have good enough grip and is high from this reason? The fact that she does well on rubberized slatless DWs in trials might be telling that…
I agree….I took her out today and ran some sequences with the DW. She had 1 leap, which she never does, and then some high hits that we can work on since they weren’t jumps. 🙂 I guess she just needs to get used to the new surface….thank you so much and hopefully I’ll have a video up of how she’s doing soon. Thanks again 🙂
Yes, should get better with experience…
Hi Silvia!
I did work more on the slatless DW, and she did improve, but she really was having grip problems and was slipping a bit. I decided to put all the slats back on, here’s a vid of the first session with the slats back on. I have a question about the last hit, I considered that really nice, should I have just rewarded or jackpotted? Thanks so much 🙂
Always JP “better as normal” hits -- and yes, the last one was certainly that.
Alrighty, will do! Thank you so much! =)