Time for a new lesson! And a "catch-up break" 🙂 I'll be home one more week to review your videos of where you are at and answer questions on how to proceed if meeting difficulties with new assignments and then you'll have two weeks to work on it on your own, catching up if you got stuck behind a little - or giving your dog some plank break if you're as far as you wanted to be with it. If you're behind, make sure to complete lesson 1 before you start with lesson 2 and that you complete lesson 2 before starting with lesson 3 - you can't jump steps, there is a reason I'm giving you this assignments in the order that I do!
I'll be back to answering on 24th June and will publish new assignments on 4th July.
1. switch to a static toy, position it at the bar of a jump with a bar on the ground. The jump should be straight forward after the plank, about 7m away. The goal is the dog starts to look for a jump, knowing the toy is there. Occasionally, still throw a toy in advance, but mostly, have it there. When the dog already knows where it is, put a jump bar very low and a toy behind it (close after it, but far enough that the dog can land normally). Keep it there long enough that the dog is expecting it there. When you see the dog is pulling well towards the jump, knowing the toy is there, get another toy and as soon as you click the contact, throw a second toy over the jump. Soon, you won't need a static toy at all anymore.
The goal is to switch from a static toy that is there as a target for the dog to focus him forward to a jump as a target to focus the dog forward and a toy as a reward we throw AFTER we see the contact is good. You need to be pretty quick as you don't want the dog to wait for the toy - so quick that I sometimes throw it before I realize the contact was actually not THAT good - but it gets easier 🙂 I guess this step will finally make everybody worried about rewarding jumps happy as now, you can withhold the toy for unsuccessful tries. HOWEVER, make sure the dog successful rate is high for this step as otherwise, you can loose the speed and get the dog checking back with you if you're throwing a toy or not. The same can be dangerous if you're late throwing a toy.
This is usually an easy step for BCs who will run full speed in anticipation of the toy, but can be a very hard one for some other dogs. For Le, that was the hardest step. She was running beautifully if the ball was still rolling when she saw it, but if I threw it that early that it was already static when she saw it (or when I positioned it there), then she didn't extend well enough. What finally worked was going few steps back with height, exciting her a lot with a toy, throwing it at the jump and sending her quickly to the dog-walk. That made her striding good enough to continue long enough to have her look for the jump and then I quickly switched to a toy, thrown after the contact is done, over the jump. That temporary caused some checking back with me, so I needed to go back to a stationary toy again, but then she finally got the idea to keep running full speed toward the jump/tunnel and trust the toy will appear then 🙂 and that again gave me the beautiful striding I had before trying to get rid of a toy, thrown in advance.
If the transition to a stationary toy is too hard, another way to try to avoid that phase is to pretend you are throwing a toy in advance, but then only throw it after. OR, using a tunnel as a way to focus the dog forward and throw it after the tunnel - works great with tunnel crazy dogs, didn't work with Le. Try and report back if you have problems.
2. keep adding height. If you have an option, it's also time to try the real thing. You can either use a lowered dog-walk or a normal dog-walk with additional plank at the end as you can see in some videos. Start with down ramp only and then slowly put the dog further&further back until you run the whole dog-walk.
When trying this or any other, new variable, don't vary other variables - make it as easy for the dog to succeed as possible. You can also lower a criteria somewhat. Normally, your criteria about hits by now should already be to be deeply in the contact - but temporary, you can click for good tries on a limit too, IF hind feet are well separated and the dog is not leaping.
3. new trick: have a dog back up on something very low and preferably soft first (folded blanket, low pillow) - then slowly add height, so that they need to pick up their hind legs higher&higher. At the same time, you can teach a "pee trick": click for lifting the leg, searching for an object, before they touch it. Make sure to try to get leg lifts on both sides - they usually prefer to go up with the same leg, so try to sometimes position them somewhat diagonally in front of an object so that their preferred leg is too far from it to start with that one. Also try climbing stairs backwards.
Have fun!
Hi Silvia, and classmates!
We didn’t manage to catch up at all (even with nice help from so many!) And now we are leaving for holiday for one week. I decided to take a break from RC until we get back. We go to a warm Italy and will be busy with foundation class between laziness.
And, I forgot to post the video (we are now already on the road) of the last session (not very good) and the trick. Atleast she does the tricks OK. Both backing up the stairs and “peeing”. I will post the video when I get back. The runnin (or leaping) is still our stage, on carpet. But I hope we will manage to proceed later on.
Enjoy your vacations! And well, a break sometimes indeed helps!
Hi Silvia,
Welcome back! We hope you enjoyed your vacation in the mountains.
We have done our best to catch up. There is definitely progress in the right direction but no consistency as of yet. I don’t believe Disco understands the criteria yet. I continue to Jackpot and have a party for the great hits and ignore the leaping. I still have the carpet on the wide plank and have gradually exposed more of the plank.
I have introduce a few new things to the practice. First I have been varying the approach distance and 15 feet seems to be the distance that gives us the best hits. I have also played with the placement of the toy. Lastly introduction to running through jump stands at the end of the contact.
I hope I have not moved ahead too much. The above changes have not greatly effected Disco’s performance but has given me greater information of what works best.
I will continue to expose the plank and get rid of the carpet. Should this be our primary goal for now? Then add height?
Thank you!
Rick & Disco
Great, I really like how he runs now. What you call a leap is actually not a leap as the last step is not any higher or longer as the one before -- it’s just a miss as he is hitting too high when going for one stride. Two are hard for him to fit in, he is shortening his second stride when he is fitting in two strides. Most probably, the best striding for him will be touching the down ramp with rear foot first, then hitting above the contact with front feet and then in the contact with hind. Try to use the set up that gives you the most (1:14 of the first video) of that striding, especially as it’s hard to get later on, when the apex is more pronounced (as that promote flying over the apex: and if he will do that, he definitely won’t be able to fit in another stride and he will probably be too short to be in with one stride only).
The good thing is that you’re getting different striding and therefore a nice variety of hits and that he is running on all tries with an ugly exception of 2:28 try in the second video: you jackpotted it, but I think this was the worst from all, his stride is unnaturally short, hind feet completely together and he is not running at all… -- not sure where you put the toy, but it looks like you put it way too close to me). It even looks to me like he is starting to understand, but it’s hard to say at this stage. However, the more understanding he has, the easier it will be to remove the carpet, so I wouldn’t rush it and instead work on other variables, including adding height -- and if that goes well, expose some more plank again -- no rush with that.
I don’t like how you set that jump though, it can affect their striding on a plank if you put it so close. I position it at a normal distance (or rather somewhat further) -- like 7m away (that would be like 7 long steps).
Hello,
httpv://www.dailymotion.com/video/k4blry87cB3bdi2dJZc
Voici notre dernière vidéo; Nous sommes remontées à 70% ou plus de bon running. J’ai oublié de mettre les numéros ! J’ai un peu monté et je pense encore monter un peu si tu es d’accord … C’est pas parfait mais je trouve ça pas mal en ce moment !
Here’s our latest video, we are back up to 70% or more of good running. I forgot to put the numbers! I just increased the height and I think rise a bit if you agree … It’s not perfect but I find it not bad right now!
Looks good! The only thing that worries me is that her nicest contacts are when her first step to the plank is with front feet right at the beginning of the plank. Once this becomes a dog-walk, there will be an apex and she will probably fly over it some, so I’m not sure she will have room for her normal 3 strides… So I would definitely try to make the set up more like normal dog-walk as soon as possible… Can you maybe somehow make a longer starting plateau so that she can gain some speed there? Like a long bench with carpet over it (or maybe another plank?), set on something high enough? You can make it higher yes, just try to find something more dog-walk-like if possible.
Hi
Barb and Mecy here
Last post Mercy was trying for three strides and you suggested that I use the static toy to see if that would slow him down and get more strides. This video is Mercy sending around a jump and runing to the static toy by a jump with the bar on the ground. I did not put it in slow mo cause I am wondering if he is going too slow now. He is still trying for three strides most of the time if I am throwing a toy or sending through the tunnel to start.
Thanks
Well, the good news is that we’re getting many really good ones now, so you have plenty to jackpot. I would now GRADUALLY put more speed into the picture by first slowly moving the starting jump further away. If he is still giving you nice hits hat way, start him at the tunnel you put in U-shape close to the dog-walk, send to a jump and go to DW. Then you can try going directly from a tunnel to DW, but set the tunnel the other way so that entry&exit don’t face the DW but the other direction, so that he needs to turn after a tunnel to take the DW then and if that is good, try the tunnel turned the normal way. If a thrown toy makes his contacts worse, then don’t throw it in advance, but work some more with a static toy and then switch to a toy, thrown after the jump. I think you will get better speed as to a static toy that way, but still not as much extension as with a toy, thrown in advance.
Hi
Thanks for your suggestions. I have started Mercy from the end of the dw and also moved the jump back several feet and run from there as well. We have not been able to progress to the other ideas with the tunnel. I have used both a static toy and a thrown toy. He is still very inconsistent, sometimes thoughtful and gathering at the end to run through the yellow, but just as often extending over the end. He doesn’t seem to do best at one or the other. All senarios are inconsistent. Some sessions he is 60% miss, maybe more, and others his % is better. Very inconsistent though and I wonder if I should continue this path or try something different that may help him to understand. He doesn’t seem to “get it” My dw is a normal U. S. dw, but is set up low, about 20 inches.
Barb and Mercy
Hm… If you go back and start him as on the last video you posted… -- Are you still getting the same % of good hits? If so, go back to that and then move the jump back more gradually… Maybe go for more height first and work on other variables instead to keep his successful rate high and have a long history of good hits before changing the problematic variable (putting the jump further back) again. Let me knwo how that goes.
No, not as good on the % as in the last video for the most part. That is why I thought I would change a bit by moving the jump back. Funny though, I just now had a very short session and Mercy got 4 of 4, one from the end and 3 with the jump. That is what is so difficult, he is so inconsistent and can be for days and looks as though he doesn’t have a clue. Then 4 good ones. I know that isn’t many but sure made me feel better. So not sure what my plan should be.
Thanks
Barb
Hm… Would be good to find a pattern when he is good and when not to get more good ones… Maybe send another video that shows more misses, maybe I can notice something?
Hi
Suddenly it seems that we are back on track. The last two days/sessions have been much better. Just one or two high in yellow. I have not added many variables, hoping to continue with good hits to jackpot, then just sends to a jump stanchen to the dw and a static toy. No misses today. I will send the video if that starts again
Wow, that’s GREAT! I love the variety of hits he is showing, his hind feet separation and also his speed is now great -- giving you 4 strides, just as he will need to run it in a final product. It should be easy from here on! 🙂
Thank you. Should I continue to add variables at this height and then change ht?
Barb
You can as well to go to the next height first, he is nicely in even when coming with speed now and also to a stationary toy, so you don’t need much more than that.
Here are our lesson 3 tricks
Barb and Mercy
Great job with the tricks too! Love his style of climbing stairs! DW training still going well I hope?
hi silvia -- welcome back!
here is our latest session. i have added height gradually as you suggested. i am alternating between throwing earlier, sending wicked to a static toy between jump stantions, and sometimes throwing a second toy (which she usually ignores b/c she gets to the static toy first). 🙂
thank you, terri
Great, this is going really well now! You can add some more height. Now that she is anticipating a toy there, you can as well not have it there anymore and simply throw it after you see the contact is o.k. -- by the time she is over the jump, the toy should be there then, of course, if the contact was good.
am i still to keep the jump very low (12″)? also, for lesson 4 and starting to move the jump -- do i keep it low? thanks, terri
Yeap, I keep it low the whole RC training, I only start using normal height shortly before putting full height DW in real sequences. If it takes you feel better, you can try normal height here and there, but I see no reason to keep jumping the dog full height all the time while in fact working on contacts…
here are our tricks for lesson 3. got a little behind on video/editing. thanks, terri
🙂 Very cool!
Hi Silvia,
I went over the video’s over and over again and I think I can narrow it down to one specific session.
Most obvious variable that changed was the addition of some height and the introduction of the wires at the upcoming end. The first tries were very nice though. I throw the ball very badly once and that makes her jump. Straight after I mark a terrible one… I do see some nice one’s in later sessions but never as consistent as before. I think we lost the hind feet separation later on when introducing the up ramp. It got worse when we started using the stationary toy.
I did not practice for a few days now. I will restart this evening on the flat plank and throw the toy again.
Do you want me to focus on hind feet separation again and ignore the placement on the plank (start over again) or do you want me to mark deep tries only?
I’ve put the session where it seems to go wrong in the video again, with the last good session before that and a few afterwards.
Yeap, let’s go flat again, no wires and again focusing just on hind feet separation: jackpotting low hits, but rewarding anything that is good running with nice hind feet separation.
Thanks for your help Silvia!
I’ve lowered my dogwalk and I’ve been alot more “picky” with what I’m rewarding with Liryk. I decided to reward hit’s like the first 2 tries you see in the video, but very “low key rewards” to see if she would offer something else…. then she kind of jumps on the 3rd try BUT…. on the 4th try, she went so much deeper!! So I had the BIGGEST party ever 😀
We had another training session this afternoon and I followed the same rules as in the video, and she seems to be offering that much deeper hit a little more.
For turns I’ve not had her do the whole dogwalk, just the down ramp and I think she seems to be trying to get her front feet in (back feet definately) Just hard to see when I’m behind her, so will video to “see” definately.
Having fun with the tricks. She does lift both hind legs, but for some reason the clip showing her lifting her right hind wouldn’t process. And had to improvise on steps 🙂 LOL
Megan and Liryk
Very cool to get some more variety of hits this time! That’s a very good start, keep rewarding them as you explained, it’s good to still reward the high hits. Great job with tricks too, love how well she climbs those steps, using both legs equally well. Great job!
Thankyou for all your help!!!
Hi Silvia:
I have a question for you. I am looking ahead at your next RC class. I am very pleased with Bender’s progress to date but somehow I do not think we will be at a full height DW at the end of another 6 weeks! I would like to continue working with you and was wondering if you are thinking of having a RC 2 class for those of us who want to carry on. If not, would you recommend that we sign up (I see that it opens in mid-July) for the RC class again that is starting in August?
thanks,
Shona and Bender
I know, it’s quite on a tight schedule to get to full height within the 3 months of the class. It’s usually not too difficult to get there once on a right track, I think you can also finish it on your own, so I didn’t plan RC part II as we’ll discuss the whole process already now. However, as I’ve heard from many how much safer they feel to have an immediate feedback, I was thinking to open an option for everybody from this class to enter next RC class for half of a price or something and keep sending videos of your progress there.
Ooooh, I would like that very much. Even though I “won my way” into this class, LOL, I have not been able to do the work you suggested with Spur on curves after the DW because of bad weather and trials and work. I am hoping I can get some of that done soon as I will be on vacation next two weeks. 😀
Thanks, Amy and Little Spur
That would be great to continue working with you Silvia, through the next class. I too would feel much better knowing you could watch our progress through the videos!
Yes, I agree…wonderful idea to be able to get feedback as we keep going! Count me in!
I too would like to continue working with you as I have had some setbacks. Illnesses, weather, vacation and injuries (fortunately minor) all haven’t helped. Tricks are going much better. I will try to post where we are at soon. Today’s session was an improvement.
Great idea, I will love to be part of that class. Thanks
I agree awesome idea!! Count me and Liryk in too 😀
Add me to the list!
I would like that too. Maia and I, well ok, I, need all the help and feedback I can get.
Well I would love that!
Hi Silivia hope you had a nice holiday. my dog is progressing nicely. i had a comment from someone recently who saw his contacts. on a slightly lowered af he is mostly doing just 2 strides hitting both contacts but high up on the down side. and he is doing the dog walk in 4 strides, he is doing split hind legs and is hitting the contact but in the higher portion of the contact zone. am i wrong to reward these? as he is doing the nice split leg i am rewarding. if he jumps he is not rewarded. when i ask for turns he uses his front legs to turn and puts in several more strides to achieve the slight angle of the turn left or right. he is rewarded. should i be asking for anything else if so how do i get more strides? cheers jo
Sounds good! How high are his usual hits (both hind feet in or just one?) and is he sometimes too high, even if not jumping, but running? If he is always in, I wouldn’t worry and would keep rewarding this, but would try to find a way to get him lower by super speedy approach -- and more experience. They usually extend more and get deeper with more confidence.
he is always in with both hind legs, some times he is higher area but sometimes it is perfect position of feet. he improves the feet position as he continues the training on that session, eg starts higher then finishes lovely on both dw and af. the af is one stride on the down side so he is launching over the apex and continuing the down side with split legs hitting the contact zone in the first and middle slat area. if i put him close to the bottom so no running start he will do 2 stride on the decent. if he has a run up he does 1 stride on the decent. i worry as he his a massive dog (hence why he can do so few strides) he may injure himself but he seems to find it easy to do the few strides on both contacts. i am finding it very hard to see the af as it is so quick i am rewarding split legs in the contact zone that is the criteria i have set him. not how many strides he does.
Two in is good enough, even if it’s high! And as I said, I’m sure he will get even deeper with more confidence. His A-frame sounds like Bi’s… She does one hit down ramp any time when coming with speed and I let it be, two would be very unnatural for her length of stride, so… It looked somewhat scary at first, but it then started to look more controlled and safer.
thank you i wont mess about with him then. i put dw up to full height yesterday as he is over 14 mths old now. i reverted back to the safe toy target for his first sessions. he was great 2 feet split hitting, first foot in the middle section and second foot in the top section. i cant wait till the lesson when we go onto turns as i have decided to not do both running and 2on2off. the foundation course training collection is great my dogs love it. cheers jo
Great!!! Keep up the good work, it’s good to have a history of nice hits before starting with turns as they can temporarily make straight exits hits worse… -- Better on a long-term, but worse as an immediate reaction to the new thing to do on contacts.
Hi Silvia,
I am currently using a low table (Check our last video) that acts as a ramp for the wide plank, As I raise the height of the wide plank should I go to a flat table and have Disco jump on this from the approach.
Thanks,
Rick
As long as it’s low, you can have him jump on it yes. Eventually, you need to build something like a mini DW… You can see many different options of set ups in the videos of others.