School time for our puppies! Here is your first to-do list. The first task might sound a little silly for those with adult dogs, but in fact, it's never silly to make a recall even better!
1. call your dog at least 10 times a day to do something fun together: to play, to go out, to get a treat, something to chew on or a new exciting toy
2. put a plate (or another object, but I like to start with a plate as puppies can't chew on those too easily) on a floor and shape a puppy to touch it with a front paw: you can first click for head movement in the right direction, then one/two/three steps, then stepping over it or close to it and finally for stepping on it
3. sit on a floor and put a fist full of treats or dog's favourite toy right in front of their nose, wait till they stop sniffing and click for anything they try other than getting directly to the food/toy or staring at it. It's very important the dog understands staring at food/toy doesn't get him anywhere as it will later on allow you to work with food/toys in your hand without distracting the dog's focus from the job at hand.
4. find a box or a drawer that is as long as your dog and not too high and shape a dog to put 1-2-3-4 legs into it. Then try with smaller&smaller objects, final goal is the dog can stand in a small bowl.
5. observe your puppy and see if he sometimes stretches his legs out when in down position, puppies often do that when relaxed or playing. Name it (I call it "frog":) and reward. It's a nice stretching exercise and very easy to get it on cue if the dog does it naturally (some dogs do it as adults too, but mine didn't and it was much harder to train it as with puppy Le who was doing that naturally). If not, put a dog in a down position and reward from the floor and so far ahead that the dog needs to stretch out to get it - but not so far that he would crawl ahead. Watch the hind legs and click for moving them back OR out, but NOT for crawling step forward.
Looking forward to see your videos!
Hi Silvia,
I’ve a question about the clicking method:
when I am waiting for her to go to the frog position, and, instead of it, she offering me another homework (for instance, sit up that she appreciates) should I click her and name it or ignore it? Because I would be speaking a lot!
Thank you
Céline
Don’t wait for her to go into the frog position! Click any hind feet movements and go from there! Something involving objects (4in) might be a better start of a shaping project, though. Anyway, don’t click for other things that she knows already or she will just keep offering those. I will sometimes reward something else if it’s really very cute, but without clicking it. I will click only for things going in the right direction OR for something really new and innovative that I can use for another project -- then I just change the plan and try to take it further right away.
Hi,
Quick question. For frog legs Spur pretty much has this down on command because she does it ALL the time, but now when I give the command (ribbit) she shoots her front legs forward and her back legs back. She’s not actually crawling forward, but the potential to do so is there. I like that she’s really stretching, but is it wrong for her to shoot her front legs forward instead of just shooting her back legs back? I’ll post video tonight.
Thanks,
Mary
No, that’s great! Even if she was crawling forward with front feet, that would be perfectly o.k., you just don’t want to click for hind feet crawling as it’s hard to get stretching then if we first click for crawling, that’s all.
Okay, here is the video of Frog Legs and Box work. We are having a bit of trouble transitioning to a smaller box, but we are working on it. Also we are having trouble with the front feet on the plate. She wants to do frog legs across the plate or lay down on the plate. We will continue to work on it.
Your ‘ribbit’ is so cute. I just love it. Kinda dive bombs for the floor…lol
The ‘ribbit’ is VERY cute! He/she seems a little unsure with the smaller box so maybe get closer to the box and try to keep rewarding very frequently. We also had to work through this.
Too cute! The slide forward for the frog is perfectly o.k., it makes it even cuter 🙂 To transition to a smaller box, try first limiting the space in this one by putting something to the side and then go from there. For a paw touch, in your case, you can try starting with something higher, so that she can’t lie down over it. Upside down bowl or something. It’s usually harder to get feet on a higher object, but then, every dog is different, you have to try to see what works best for yours 🙂
I LOVE the ribbit!! Really, really cute!!!
Ribbit is great!!!! Jackpots worked great for us as well as a vocal marker/ praise when Da Vinci was starting to get it, but not quite sure. The big party made it much clearer for him. Helped him get the big picture and then he would test our the parameters by moving one foot or another into and out of the box to see what combination worked or didn’t work.
Hello,
Here are our latest box and frog videos. The putting the smaller box in the bigger box that Silvia suggested is working for us. Still a little standing on the edge but going well. The frog is going well, sometimes he does do both legs (of course not for the video) but it seems to sort of depend on how he is positioned on the pillow. PS. Wylie now gets excited when I start setting up the video camera. Ok, I do have a thing for cutting off my dog’s head on videos 🙂 Best, Sara and Wylie
btw, during part of the frog video I tried to not reward only the one leg but when he did not offer both legs then I went back to just rewarding one. It seemed liked the other leg was more stuck under him. Maybe next time I will try to get him off the end so I might get more two legs. Any other ideas?
But you are getting both legs? It’s just on the last try that right leg is tucked under, first two tries he had both out. It sure looks very good to me!
Both seems to be going really well! Time for a smaller box 🙂
After mentioning that I had a pig in my bathroom, Silvia asked if we were going to see any video’s of Sloppy the pig. So here it is Sloppy the pig sitting. You can really see how operant conditioning works when you train a pig. You can’t push them around. Watch how the pig jumps when it hears the click.
Here is a mini-video of our progress on the 4in exercise. Her food dish is a little smaller than this kids shoe box, so we will be trying that next… She really understands the behaviour and offers it so nicely! No prompting or luring! 🙂
That’s really small already for a Golden! But she seems completely balanced, so I’m sure she ill master the bowl in no time too!
I’ll try the video again.
Sloppy is adorable!!!!
What a smart little pig! 🙂
Wow, that’s a really smart little pig!!! That’s amazing how fast he was offering a sit all on his own and that second circle, he is doing almost without the help of the hand already! Thanks for posting it, would love to see more! Once you lowered the criteria and started clicking more, his focus and willingness to offer things was AMAZING! And yes, I guess that’s about how my dogs would behave if I was modeling them into something… Well, maybe not THAT loud! 🙂
Is it o.k. if I share your video with other visitors of the site? I think it shows very well how important frequency of clicking and not forcing an animal into that or another thing is.
Wow! That really is amazing. I am going back to work on my box. I love that piglet!
Oh my! That is so cute! I love it!
Wonderful example of how increased reinforcement will produce faster results! Very smart little pig!!
Sure, you can share Sloppy’s video with any one you like. I was going to stop training him, but maybe I will try to teach him some more things.
Lets have sloppy (top name, btw) do all the tricks of the class with everyone else. Pigs are meant to be smarter than dogs so why not?
Great, thanks! And yes, I think we have room for another puppy student! 🙂
I just noticed I posted this at the wrong place. So here it is again. 😉
Hi Silvia and Classmates,
Here is our second video. Keen is doing really good! Now I need to work on my filming talents. The angles are not that good.
We have been working on the Frog trick with the help of a cushion, since sunday.
First on the double green cushion you see in the video. On tuesday I switched to the single cushion, yesterday to the dogbed. It went really fast. Today I got the frog instantly when we started the session, on a real thin dogbed, and just 5 minutes ago I got a “Frog” while I was working on the “not focus on food in my hand” exercise, whithout a cushion! It went really fast. When we started this it was the only task I was thinking we could never get right, but now I have good hope!
Do you think it’s time to start naming it?
On monday I started with the 4 feet in the box trick. In the video she already had 3 in. Today we got all 4 in! The fact that she knew the 4 feet on a small surface certainly helped but still she struggled a bit to get that 4th foot in the box.
As you can see in the video she starts to understand that trying to get food out of my hand does not get here anyware. But during the clicker sessions for other excercises she still focusses on my hand. During the target training I throw the food like you advised to get that focus away from my hand.
We are really enjoying this and it is great to see how so many people are so enthousiastic and all make such good progress!
Keen you are a very clever girl!! And you have a talented Mom! 🙂
Thanks Cheryl! Keen is a very clever girl indeed!If I looked like being talented it is because off Keen being such a clever dog! 😉
Ups, I didn’t notice either, so I just answered where you first posted it, see it there…
Here’s my 2nd video of lesson #1. I have a few questions.
#1 Is it ok to scream or cry in this class. After all it is a long distance class and no one would hear me. just kidding!
I did run into some challenges with the four feet in the dish. As you will see in the video, Zip likes to chew on the dishes. I have a set of feed dishes for feeding animals with. Big to vary small, but they are made of rubber and have yummy tastes to them. Bad choice I know. Then I made a wood box and he thought it was a chew toy.
So then I decided to start taking the dish away every time he started to chew on it. That is working but he still wants to chew sometimes.
I started to realize I had gone to fast trying to get to a smaller dish and so I wasn’t reinforcing often enough. Also, the comment from the pig video about clicking more helped me a lot. How funny is that. So I went back to a bigger dish and clicked for just two paws then four and then went to a smaller dish. Kind of pin ponged it back and forth. That helped. But I would like to hear comments about this. I will make the question #2 so you can answer easier.
#2 Pin Ponging. Do you do it? Would you pin pong big dish small dish? Would you pin pong one paw in -- four paws in. In other words would you click for one paw in after the dog has already done four paws in? If you pin pong, do you find yourself pin ponging a lot in your shaping with your dogs?
The good news, recalls are coming vary good!! We haven’t even started the frog thing : (
Thanks for any comments everyone has on this!
When working on shaping a behaviour, e.g. smaller and smaller boxes/bowls, i tend to move very gradually, maintaining a high rate of reinforcement. Sometimes at the start of a session I go with the bigger box, just to get her in the 4in mode, then move on to a smaller one. If he understands the behaviour, he should be offering it by himself, no need to reshape every time you change box.. If he is not offering it, maybe the change in size of container is too drastic, or he doesnt really understand. Also, once you get 4 paws in, i dont think you need to click for less than that.. Keep you criteria clear and steadily increase difficulty such that the dog can succeed.. If you need to constantly go back, I think u are probably going too far too fast!!
Just my thoughts though, with Summer we get a very steady upward trend when training a new behaviour.. Maybe others do it differently? 🙂
Cheryl, thanks for you input on this. I would like to know what others think. Especially about once you get 4 paws in, you wouldn’t click for less. I was thinking I was on to something and getting a little excited about it.
Cheryl were you referring to my video being private? I think it’s ok? I can see it on this website.
Yep! I’m sorry if I came across too strongly! I didn’t mean to say you are doing it wrong..
Maybe because Summer is an older and more serious dog, she tends to work very systematically and offer behaviours exactly as they were clicked for before, so I have little experience with going back and forth, but I could definitely see value!
Though I think I would use it at the start of a session -- to get going, and take it from there.. If he is losing focus and starts offering less -within- one session, then it’s probably too far too fast or he can’t work that long..
I hope I didn’t come across as rude or know-it-all! Sorry!
I agree with most of it, but I do prefer to go back and click for less over waiting until the dog looses focus. But I definitely agree that we need a bigger box here until he goes in immediately, showing he really understands the job. Once you have this, switching to smaller boxes is pretty easy if you do it gradually enough.
the video is private =(
Cheryl, You were wright. I changed now. Thanks for letting me know.
Wow, Zip did quite some growing since your last video! He is such a fun puppy, keep your eyes off the toy game was great! But yes, you definitely have this tendency to try to get too much in too little time and then you get less as if you were happy with small things. In dog training, taking your time and doing it slowly is usually the fastest way to the goal 🙂 I would actually still use the bigger dish until he immediately hops in with all 4 feet, then try the smaller one again, lower the criteria again and click for 1-2-3-4 again and then go from there. I will lower the criteria any time there is a new element in play that makes it more difficult, either the distraction (dishes that are cool to chew on, unknown environment, another dog around etc.) or the level of an exercise (smaller box). If even lower criteria doesn’t allow me to click 10 times as frequently as you do, I stop and try again with less distractions or on another level (bigger box). So yes, I have no problems with clicking for less if that’s all I’m getting in that particular situation. With puppies, I will actually do it very often as keeping their focus and having them having fun is more important as any trick. Soon, I don’t see the need to do it very often anymore, so I don’t do it much anymore, but have no problem with it if I see the need to at any point.
Hmm, thought of a question while working on all this. Typically I use (and love!) clickers. The clicker worked as well with the puppy, but she was a bit obsessed with it and would try and bite it and run away with it (maybe she thinks food will come OUT of it?? 🙂 ). So I set it aside until she grew up a bit and started marking with “yes” instead. Seems to work fine, just wondering if anyone else has done this and finds they run into any issues down the road? Do you think it lacks the specificity of a click?
My bc, Arcade does the same with clickers. I find he enjoys shaping much less when I use a verbal marker, it’s like he enjoys just hearing clicks. I did a bit of impulse control work with the clicker because he would run off with it. Didn’t take long for him to figure it out that the work stops if he takes the clicker 🙂 There was research done on verbal vs clicker and studies show that it does speed along the process. I don’t think you will have “issues” down the road by using verbal though. I like to mix it up as well.
I like to use both. Because you will not always have a clicker with you. Or you might need both hands. I like the clicker better, because it has a distinct sound that the dog can pick up fast.
I think a word works pretty well with most behaviours, especially those that require duration (4in, sit, down, frog…), but for “details training” -- like high legs in heeling for example, I hardly imagine doing it without the clicker.