So... Here is the plan. As agility is easier to show as to explain, you'll be getting your homeworks in video form. You'll always get some new assignments, but you need to keep practicing the old ones too - we'll be checking back on those here and there, so don't forget to keep working on those!
This class program is very extensive and after discussing it with 1st class students, I decided to give you some more time for last three lessons: first three you'll get every 2 weeks and last three every 3 weeks and we'll also make a 2-week break somewhere in between to let you catch up. As always, taking things slowly is always better and takes you to the goal faster as rushing things up, that's why I'm giving you more time for your homeworks.
1. restrained send to cik/cap - the purpose of this exercise is to play a nice chasing game, while teaching great sends, distance work and commitment - see how early I can start running in the other direction when sending Le to the jump.
Things to pay attention to:
- height: If you only did cik&cap on other objects so far, start with a jump stanchion now, but without the bar first: and then put the bar VERY low - max. 5cm (2 inches) for smaller dogs, 10cm (4 inches) for BC size and bigger. You can then add some height every 5 sessions: 3cm up for small dogs, 5cm for bigger dogs - SLOWER with young dogs! If you already did cik&cap with more height, do this exercise on your normal height, send a video and I will tell you if it's o.k. or you need to make it lower.
- distance: Start the dog very close to the jump first and then further&further every next try to slowly add distance. If the dog turns back to you (as Le does once in my video) or waits for you, start closer again and add distance more gradually.
- angle: Note from which angle I bring Le to the jump and in which direction I run away to reward. The purpose is to teach them to jump close to the stanchion, NOT in the middle of the bar! That's why I always do this side approach FIRST and do lots of it before trying any straight approaches. Check the angle again as it's not the best angle to see and many people do it coming to the jump facing it and then running parallel to it away and then the dogs are back-jumping the jump. You want to come to the jump from the side (nearing the stanchion/wing first) and then run away perpendicular to it.
- speed: You can't expect much speed with multi-warps, but you definitely want it now. Restrain the dog, wait for a good pull, let him go and run away for them to chase you&the toy. Make sure the dog is rewarded when still moving - don't stop and reward: run and reward! 🙂
2. If the first part goes well, you can also do some figure 8s + chase it game: it's the same game, only that you use two jumps now and run from one to another, sometimes still rewarding the first wrap, sometimes 4th, sometimes 2nd, sometimes 5th, sometimes 3rd... Note the angle of the jumps (side approach again!) and the distance between them: you want BIG distance to get good speed - something like 10m/33'. Again, you want the jumps under this angle to make sure the dog is jumping close to the stanchion, not in the middle of the bar. DON'T do figure 8s on one jump, it teaches the dog to jump in the middle!
3. restrained send to a tunnel (obstacle discrimination!) + come to hand vs. go game
Restrain the dog very close to the tunnel, as he is pulling towards it, say "tunnel, tunnel" to them: pulling in the direction of that thing is what you want when you say "tunnel" - and then let them go. Slowly add distance. Later on, you can add more obstacles (jumps&contact) close to the tunnel to make the discrimination harder: only say "tunnel" when the dog is pulling in the right direction, you can feel it if you hold him. You do the same with jumps: call cik&cap and release to the jump that is first the only thing around and then add tunnels closer&closer. The goal is teaching obstacle discrimination AND actively pulling towards obstacles you call (as opposed to hanging with you, waiting for you to take them all the way to each obstacle).
To train even more things at the time, when the dog is out of the tunnel, either call to hand and when he is at your side, either do a front cross or a shoulder pull (see the video) and reward for closeness - OR say your magic "run FAST" word and throw a toy ahead when the dog is catching up with you - meaning that you're moving in both situations, do NOT stand still when you send!
To make it even more challenging and train three things at the time 🙂 you can also add more tunnels and jumps around, like this:
Try to change it some every time, like bringing the other tunnel closer, or curving it sometimes, or using a jump instead, and also try running by it (to the other entry maybe) while calling to hand so that the dog needs to stay with you even when you’re actually moving towards the tunnel/jump and similar.
4. independent weaves
If you haven't started weaves yet, set 12 poles in two rows (left row must always be 60cm/24inches closer to you when you stand in front of the channel in order to teach them correct entries), at least 1m apart, restrain the dog at least 3m before the channel, throw the toy through and release. As the dog is running to his toy, sometimes just stand back, sometimes run after him, on both sides, sometimes far, sometimes close, sometimes run and stop, sometimes run and turn etc. The purpose is to teach the dog to ignore your body language when in the weaves and complete the task. Slowly switch to a static toy 4m after the channel, bringing the two rows closer&closer as you practise independent performance (I'm using bowls with treats with Le as she isn't too excited about dead toys... - but I quickly switched to a toy, thrown after she is out then to get more speed). See the video for some ideas on what to do when the dog is in a channel. If the dog already knows the weaves, send the video of how independent it is. If it's not, go back to the channel. With puppies, you can start the channel work, but only play with it max. twice a week, to not progress too fast as you don't want to close it to the point that requires real weaving before the dog is fully grown. But you can do a lot of work on independence and entries without doing any real weaving.
Have fun!
Today was the first day Lil practiced Loop and Wrap with 2 widely spaced jumps (25-30′), with one additional straight jump between them. Lil seemed to have better obstacle focus after I added the straight jump in the middle. I think the vast distance between the two jumps was too much for her to grasp. I will try it again in 5-7 days and see how she does with it.
I was very pleased with her energy and speed since she has never been 100% confident at this facility. Not sure if it is the sightly wet dirt or a scent but she has a great work ethic so even if she is not 100% confident, she gives it her all.
I added a soundtrack of “Jovial Jasper” performed by a friend’s percussion band, Nexus. There was too much ambient noise….happy dogs eager for their turns plus my high-pitched GO GO GO when Lil was weaving. I really should do something about that (my voice… not the happy dogs!)
What a great commitment! But yes, maybe try a normal figure 8 first and then add the middle jump. Nice weaves too, just make those entries and challenges more&more extreme gradually.
Silvia, When do you think I should start raising all jumps? Lil has taken a month off from jumping full height. And do you think Lil is ready to raise the LOOP & WRAP jumps up from 4″ to 5″?
I actually wouldn’t raise it until you get rid of the early take off that I noted in my previous reply…
I am finding that the mechanics of how to deliver the reward (toy) are more difficult than they look (for me at least). When I watch Silvia work with her dog, I think “I CAN DO THAT” then I go out and try to do it, and realize I can’t do it…..yet.
I must have watched the Lesson One video at least a dozen times, focusing on Silvia’s timing and motion: how, where and when she throws the reward. I think I need to practice the mechanics of rewarding with a toy on a string without my dog before I try to use it with my dog. I find it so challenging to run, drop the toy at just the right moment and let it fly behind me while my dog chases it, then fling the toy forward at just the right moment so my dog is accelerating when she gets the reward. It seems to me that if my timing is off (which it is right now), I’m rewarding slowing down.
This really is a lot of fun though. I love challenges and I love to improve my mechanics! And Lil’s enthusiasm for these games keeps going and going…. like the energizer bunny.
Over the past couple of days, I have started working on improving my mechanics in order to reward my dogs by flinging a toy on a rope forward to initiate a game of tug. I have practiced the mechanics without my dogs for a few minutes here and there and I thought I had it figured out well enough to try it with my dogs.
But the first time I tried rewarding by dogs with a toy on a rope, it didn’t work nearly as well. I thought the problem was with my timing and mechanics, but after a short session of just playing with my dogs and a toy on a rope yesterday, I realized that I had inadvertently trained my dogs NOT to run past me if I am also running. GASP! 🙂
My dogs both do a lot of freestyle tricks in heel position on both sides so they have been heavily reinforced for being at my side. We also play “recall to side” games with distractions ahead (like the Manners Minder) and flat work where they know the game is to stay at my side no matter what I do, whether I am running fast and stopping abruptly, doing front crosses, post turns, or circling with my dogs on the inside and outside of the circles. They both really enjoy these games, but I am fairly certain that when they are chasing me while I am running with a toy on a rope, they think they are doing the right thing by staying at my side vs. driving ahead to grab the toy when I fling it forward. They are just being good dogs!
There are so many awesome dogs in this Agility Foundations class, including some amazing high-drive, toy-focused dogs. As I watch these dogs drive out of turns or tunnels in pursuit of a thrown ball, I am blown away…and a little envious 🙂 of their speed and drive for the toy.
Currently my dogs’ past training (and natural tendencies perhaps) have made them too handler focused so they are overly responsive to my motion (acceleration/ deceleration/ shoulder turns…). So instead of running ahead to grab a toy that I fling forward on a rope, they stay running at my side.
Now that I am aware of this, I am going to shift the balance by playing a lot more “Race Me” games and GO GO GO games (which are already part of this class) so I can reinforce my dogs for running past me until each dog has a good balance of GO GO GO and coming to my side. When I say GO ON, GET IT, or GO GO GO, I want them to know it is OK and GREAT to race past me to whatever is in front of them, whether it is an obstacle, a toy on a rope, or a thrown ball. I can envision this being a lot fun for all of us!
In the mean time, I will continue to reward by throwing a ball, while I play with toys on a rope as a separate activity until my dogs figure out how to play this new and fun chasing/ tugging game.
I am enjoying this class so much. It is challenging and I love learning how to become a better trainer and handler. Plus my dogs’ enthusiasm for Silvia’s games keeps going and going…. they are like little Energizer Bunnies.
Gosh! Sorry to be posting again about toys on a rope but I just successfully rewarded Lil with a toy on a rope doing Loops and Wraps around a pole in my backyard. While I was running, she raced by me and grabbed the toy every single time. This new game certainly didn’t take long for her to get! Then she tugged like there was no tomorrow! Her best tugging ever. She wouldn’t even drop the toy like she always does when I say drop it. I think this is a very good thing for my normally very obedient little girlie. Prey drive won out! YEY! She did eventually drop it and I immediately flung it out again for her to chase. Sorry if I’m being overly gushy here but I can’t believe Lil got so crazy (in a good way)! I promise this is my last post about Toys on Ropes!!! 🙂
Yay for Lil! Not dropping a toy is always a good sign, I agree!!! 🙂
Very good observation, it’s probably in fact the reason why they won’t drive after a toy! But if they will drive after a ball, that’s a good start already. I never understood why running past me and throwing balls would be bad -- only heard it’s a bad thing a couple of years ago anyway 🙂 -- I think it’s great!!! I want my dogs to drive ahead as hard as they can -- and when I want them to stay close, I just tell them so 🙂 I want them to really understand both, handler and obstacle focus. Works great for me!
Silvia, One of the things I love about the way you coach your students is that you suggest different approaches for different dogs vs. sayings stuff like: “All dogs in this class must do X, Y, Z and if you cannot get your dog to do X, Y, Z, then there is something wrong with your training or (worse yet) you have a bad relationship with your dog…” which is so ludicrous!
I heard chasing a ball is a bad thing to do with agilty dogs so I stopped playing fetch with Lil for about 9 months (and Lil loves to play fetch). Silly me for not questioning that statement!
Very often, finding ways to work around NOT-having X, Y, Z builds the best relationship 🙂 I noticed that with my dogs -- letting them be who they are and working around their weaknesses, focusing on their strengths instead, makes us a real team. I think they really appreciate I appreciate just how they are.
Hahahaha, yes, as you know I have had to work hard on Spur’s restrains and had trouble finding the right harness and such. Today, since we still have a snow covered agility yard, I opted to take him for a long beach walk, but we worked on restrains there to chase the seagulls. I used my “magic word” and pulled on his harness and he was FLAILING to GO and he went FLYING after the seagulls!!! He is starting to really LOVE his harness restrains! He still cringes some when I go to reach for it, but I can see he is starting to get more and more excited about that.
I am a professional dog walker and the last thing I want from my client’s dogs is one who pulls on the harness, but for Spur we SURE want that!!! LOL!! I am breaking the rules with MY dog!!!
Very cool!!!
Hi Silvia,
Here is part of Twig’s Lesson 1. I should say this is lesson 1 improvised. I was tight on time and all I could video was the cik/cap work. We are currently on a 1 month RV trip 2000 miles away from home--the good news is all the dogs are with us. I did bring 2 stick in the ground poles and traffic cones to help work on more cik/cap while we are gone. When we return I’ll video her tunnel sends and weave poles and include updated sequences.
I modified your exercises and used primarily poles to help keep things simple and work on her being tight. Twig has no toy drive, but she does goes nuts for a beef rib bone. As you can see she’ll also tug the bone.
I feel like my timing is off and I’m a bit awkward. But this month of travel and focus on cik/cap should really help. BTW I use zig (right) and zag (left) for her turns. Thanks for your input! Carrie
Oh, she was too cute when she does a perfect wrap when you are still saying a good girl! Showing a really great speed and tightness, very cool! You sometimes push on her line too much and push her wider -- make sure you stay out of her way. And when she pulls off, you are really going for too big degree of a warp -- if you see some videos of the warps on jumps, you’ll see the run-away line is perpendicular to the line of the approach. When you use a jump again, put the bar lower, that’s quite a height already for this size of a dog! I would also put that bone on a string and have her chase it before she can tug and chew on it -- I think she will like that. That way, you can reward in movement rather as stop&reward. She has some super speedy moments that we sure want to see during the whole session!
Hi Silvia,
Here is Gemini’s improvised lesson 1. It is much like Twig’s. Unfortunately a day when her focus wasn’t as strong and neither was mine. In my review of things I noticed that my body language doesn’t reflect much trust and I’m not sure why I’m stopping and rewarding instead of doing it on the run. I’ll incorporate that into our “on the road” practice sessions. I also included a lot of our struggles this video session. Toward the end she is cutting behind my back a bit more than usual…hmmm.
I’ll keep working on her cik/cap while we are on the road as well as any suggestions you may have. Upon our return, I’ll video her tunnel sends and weave poles. BTW I did bring some things to help work contacts including the dreaded teeter:-)
Thanks,
Carrie
Yes, you definitely want to reward on the run and help less with the body language and leave earlier as waiting for her that long often makes her wider as she is watching you, waiting for you to move. She also sometimes pushes out when you go too far with her, so definitely let her do it more independently, she can do it! She was crossing behind when you don’t reconnect enough after the tunnel/a turn -- you need to reconnect, open your shoulders a bit towards her and use a lowered hand to let her know which side you want her too. And I think her focus is perfectly good, she is happy to work and loves to run -- that’s all you need! Great job!
Here was our first attempt with cik/cap. I’ve been working on restraint with Fleet but he still is totally comfortable with it as I noticed towards the end of the video. I also see that I did the exercise incorrectly after watching the other videos and reading your comments. I muted the video as there was A LOT of noise going on during our training session. One of my neighbors was doing something that sounded very much like target shooting or something with a cannon. Very loud! Nice chance though to work through noise distractions. 🙂 I also had the channel weaves set up so let him try that for the first time. Unfortunately my tape ran out so video. He did pretty good just running through it to a static frisbee. I also tossed it a couple times. If the weather is cooperates, I’ll get video of that soon.
Looks nice and tight, but yes, try running perpendicular as that will allow you to leave earlier and will probably make him drive to the jump even more. Slowly add more distance too. For the weaves, just continue like that, introducing some independence challenges already now.
Ok here is my first attempt at lesson one. As I was training I could tell Mya was really tired from protection training earlier in the day (and she is still in heat) but I am already one week behind so I didn’t want to wait any longer to start lesson one. She did pretty good I think. She definitely turns easier to the right. When I started turns to the left I think she thought she was going to the dogwalk. 🙂
I also realized I was doing the tunnel exercise wrong. I should reward after the Front Cross or pull but I am rewarding after the second tunnel. I will fix that tomorrow when hopefully I can train again! 🙂
wow, that’s tight! So impressive with a big dog, he’ll look amazing when eventually doing cik&cap in full height. 🙂
Thanks Lotta! 🙂
Silvia, I forgot to ask, should I be using a wing instead of a wingless jump for Cik and Cap?
She looks really good even when tired! 🙂 If the DW around is an extra challenge to her, you can train it with a DW there, you could also set a tunnel close by. Slowly add more distance and next try figure 8 too. You don’t need wings no. Nice sends to a tunnel, don’t forget to always call her name for coming close and say go for driving ahead.
Silvia I just read your comment, I have a doubt about saying -go- for driving ahead.
I use -go- cue as release word ( 2o2o or table etc.. ) and -Taille Taille Taille- for -run, run, run-. So for driving ahead, I must use -Taille taille taille- isn’t it?
Yes, sure. You need two different cues, one for a release and one for driving ahead -- and you can choose whatever words you want.
Ok, so here is another video we made yesterday, with adding some distance in cik/cak -I tryed to add a bar on small level but she went underneath it :O so I decied to start just putting a bar on the ground and than slowly raise it.
We did some tunnels (I forgot to do the front cross…:P) and wave-pools that we did for the first time -- I have to say that as she was focusing on the ball from the start so I narrowed the tunnel quite a bit at the end. Is the toy too near the end of the waves?
Petra, your dog was awesome! Loved her energy and intensity. 🙂
Petra, she looks great!! 🙂 And big! 🙂
Petra, you channel is set wrong! The first pole must be on which side of a dog, huh? 🙂 No worries if you just did one session, but do double check it for next sessions. Try to set the ball a bit further yes and introduce some distractions as she is driving to a ball. She is driving to her cik&caps and a tunnel really well too, great speed! You wait a bit too long on cik&caps sometimes (like at 0:21: you bend and wait and watch -- RUN instead!), but the rest all looks great, nice and tight. But you can’t go directly to 35cm though -- you need to start with 10 or 15 and then add height by 5cm at the time… She is a bit wider on come to hand after the tunnel, practice that some more and try to keep her close the whole time -- did you call her in time? She looks surprised by the turn and gets thrown out some. Nice to see Ilirija all dried up, have to come one of those days! 🙂
OMG! You are right!!! I did not pay attention to that I just used the waves (they were all set :O).
I saw that I’m waiting -- guess I want to make sure she takes the turn…have to have more trust in her. And that is my problem! also with Saia…
In the tunnel, I was calling her name all the time as she was still in and coming out. We will practice!
Thank you!
Yes Ilirija was dry -- surpraisingly 🙂
Thank you Nina and Shirley. She is intense…after every session I’m missing a part of my finger, arm or leg as she is so excited to work :O
Okay, I find the format of this forum extremely confusing and difficult to nagivate. Is there a way to get the forum to send you an e-mail to alert you when a question you have posted has a response? I have posted questions on other forums and that’s a common option so you don’t have to wade through a lot of other questions and information not related to your question. Usually the e-mail contains a link that points you directly to the question that you posted and it’s responses and comments. That would make things so much easier for people. I posted a question and then went to a 3 day agility trial. I’ve waded through pages and pages but can’t find the question to see if I got a response.
My original question was about handler position. The videographer was following the dog so I couldn’t figure out the handler position. It appeared to me as if Sylvia was running past the jump while the dog was wrapping back around in the direction Sylvia originally came from, which doesn’t make sense to me. If I continue to run forward I expect my dog to come with me, not to wrap backwards. So does that mean that the handler is actually holding back and not going past the plane of the jump before the wrap starts?
My last question is about weave poles. I haven’t taught my dog anything about weaving yet because I just a couple of weeks ago figured out how he learns. Basically the clicker, drills, tricks and shaping are pretty much going to be wasted effort on this boy. To him each activity is a unique situation. I’ve worked with him with the clicker for a year now and all it means to him is “treat”. When trying to shape if you try to wait him out, he’ll get bored and try to lay down and go to sleep. This boy doesn’t ponder much of anything. He’s not stupid, but he just doesn’t bother to think about things. He’s not interested in figuring things out. He’s more into rote memorization. If you show him exactly what you want, he’ll do it and repeat it on command as many times as you want. Considering this, do you have any suggestions on the best way to teach this boy to weave? I’m not certain what method might have meaning to him considering his lack of thought process.
Your question and the answer are on 2nd page. The posts are in time order they were posted, so if you told me which day you posted it, I could find it immediately. But well, the thing is I don’t want people to only read a response to their question. I want them to learn, I want them to see videos of others, learn about all possible problems and solutions -- that’s why we’re doing it in a class form. It makes no sense otherwise.
As for weave question: channel. It’s not shaping, it’s not clicker, it’s very easy and doesn’t require any thinking.
I have no clue what day I posted my question. I didn’t know I’d have to remember. I’m used to forum formats that let you link directly to your question in addition to allowing you to browse through the other posts. Just because the format allows you to directly access your question and response doesn’t mean it precludes browsing through all other questions and responses. It’s not an either/or situation. The direct link to questions is a convenience for the poster to easily see their question and response IN ADDITION to being able to browse all questions and responses sequentially. It doesn’t make sense to me to not allow that sort of convenience to students just because you think that accessing only their own question might be the only thing the student will do given the opportunity. Frankly, if all a student wants to do is access only their own question and answer, it’s their choice to not take advantage of the wealth of information provided. Keeping this format won’t change that. Changing the format to add direct access in addition to browse capability only makes this class more user friendly and therefore more attractive to more students. You should check out some of the large support forums to see the format.
Now to comment on the channel weaves, I will have to not address weave issues with my dog in this class as I don’t have access to channel weave poles anymore. But I’ll give it a try when I can get access to some. We’ll see what he does.
Oh, you can bookmark your comments. Above each post, it says “on 2012/03/06 at 18:02” for example, you that click the date/hour link and you will see the direct link to that comment and can bookmark it. Your other question&answer is on page 3.
Are you here to learn or “should” all over the place? Access to an Olympic athlete/instructor is a privilege average people don’t have in most sports, and I’d appreciate it if you checked your approach to this information and Silvia’s valuable time.
As someone who is currently enrolled in 4 of these classes, and 3 local classes, I’m grateful to those who read through the posts (which, as an instructor, I know everyone is not going to do their homework…they never all do) and don’t post the same questions. A lot of times an instructor will do something specific (or withhold certain information) for a well thought out reason, as experience teaches how people can better receive the teachings. If you’re not receptive to what’s to offer, you are missing a great deal. You’re clearly not trying to work with the program.
If you want to do channel weaves, you can make it happen by getting stick in the ground poles at the hardware store.
Cheri, I hope that you will find that it’s worth the effort to adjust to Silvia’s unique classrooms. I agree with you that it’s quite different from other online forums. I think that you will find that is true for most of her brilliant concepts. 🙂 I also think if you calculate how much you spent in those “other” forums, perhaps even considering “cost per reply” from the instructor, you will find Silvia to be an amazing value that I’m sure most of us would pay far more to receive. I am currently attending 5 classes with 2 different dogs, and I am in HEAVEN.
As for channel weaves, not sure if you are in the US, but if so, I know an excellent source online for stick-in-the-ground weaves for $40.
Hi Silvia, Here are our further attempts at cik&cap round the jump wings, also a little bit of tunnel although I’m afraid it was not well in view of the camera. I think Ponto is still jumping too much in the middle of the pole. Maybe it is because she and I have done agility velcro-like for years and we both find it difficult to adjust. Will keep trying, should I go back to using just a pole again, I get her going around a cone inside the house, and round a stool and anything else we can.
Hm, this is still not a good approach and exit to teach her closeness to the wing… Go for the side approach and full wraps for now -- see some videos of others. Don’t do straight approaches yet. Figure 8s were good this time, just spread the jumps even more and drop the closer end of a bar to the ground to promote staying close to that wing. And then reward in the direction that “closes” the wrap.
To practice distance, try sending her to a tunnel from further&further AND reward by throwing ahead to teach her driving forward. Only reward for coming back to you when you call her to come to hand! If she is a velcro dog, do more repetitions of a go as of coming to hand! Have fun!
Thank you Silvia, I think it is taking me some time to understand what I am doing, let alone for Ponto. I watched nearly all the videos and particularly the ones from Melanie with Grit (slow motion from above), and Amy with Spur Restrains to the tunnel. Today I will concentrate on one jump with full wraps and bar on ground rewarding in the direction that closes the wrap. Also, the tunnel. Yesterday the tunnel was wet inside at first and she didn’t even want to go in, which isn’t like her. I really want to learn to be a better agility handler so will keep going, albeit slowly.
I know, it can be hard at the beginning, we had several people starting out with agility through those classes and it was hard for them to imagine the angle and correct path at first, but they all got really good by the end, so I’m sure things will just get easier&easier! You can try it without the dog first -- despite I’m sure Ponto will want to join in too!